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Post by bcguide on Oct 20, 2014 0:55:26 GMT -5
Could anyone tell me what makes the s3 a better frame for the h1 motor
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Post by Jim on Oct 20, 2014 11:06:10 GMT -5
I have one in my shop right now. I haven't ridden it yet, but I can tell you it's small and light.
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Post by Walms on Oct 20, 2014 11:15:55 GMT -5
Yup, lighter and smaller. The KH400 is the best frame of the bunch because of the gusseting at the headstock. The only place where the KH400 needs to be beefed up is in the swingarm pivot area.
Going with beefier fork springs also helps for the added weight of the motor.
I couldn't really tell you exactly why it works well because I just copied Mraxle's project but it does handle very well... In fact most guys that have tried my bike have all started making one for themselves.
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Post by autofobe on Oct 20, 2014 15:02:42 GMT -5
The 400 frame handles good with the 400 motor.I raced one & it worked really well.That being said It is not lighter than the early 500 frame.I raced one of those also & with a few additional gussets that frame handled like a champ.Though with the extra frame gussets may have weighed about the same as the 400.The late kh 500 frame has more gussets (about the same as the 400) than the early 500 but is much heavier.I guess it's more what you want.Do you want to make motor mounts or brace a frame.I prefer the early 500 braced.
The 400 front end is shorter & with a 18 front wheel the clearance is limited.It's hard enough trying to keep the pipes from dragging.I doubt there is more than 15 lbs difference between all the frames.Just miss a couple of meals & you are there.Better shocks & springs & good swingarm bush go a long way.
Brad
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Post by Walms on Oct 20, 2014 15:24:42 GMT -5
The frame being at least 1" taller and using bigger diameter tubes, I find it hard to believe... I have both frames at home but I'm too lazy to dig them out! Lol but there is allot of weight savings by using the 400 forks, rims and hubs.
I'm sure most of the issues with the stock H1 frame has to do with the 19" front tire IMO
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Post by autofobe on Oct 20, 2014 15:57:27 GMT -5
You are right.The fork,hubs & 400 motor are lighter.Yet the early 500 is only about 25 pounds heavier than the 400.After subtracting all that,you think there is much difference in the frame weight.
I did use the 400 front end & hub laced to a flanged rim on my 500 race bike to get better access to race rubber in 18". Ground clearance suffered & I went back to the 36mm.Handling is always better with thicker forks.Some weight saving is not worth it.
Brad
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Post by Walms on Oct 20, 2014 18:37:48 GMT -5
Famous last words about being too lazy! Haha Only 3 lbs difference 45-42 Being so much more compact is where the 400 gets it's rigidity compared to the H1F-08xxx It would be nice if Leo would chime in on this but I thought he said the 400 front forks were good enough for 125mph corners for him. He said even though they flex the bike holds it's line.   |
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Post by autofobe on Oct 20, 2014 20:23:00 GMT -5
I believe the early 500 frame is even lighter.I was not knocking the 400 front end,It worked well.But being shorter made ground clearance a little tight. No doubt the 400 is the best balanced all around working/handling package of the triples.Just not sure that can be said with the 500 in there.(my opinion only)With a little care & the parts,they all can be made to handle.Anybody got an early 500 frame they can weigh.
Brad
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Post by JA-Moo on Oct 20, 2014 22:04:24 GMT -5
I have done a lot of handling tuning on the late 500 frame through the years, and pretty much got it to probably the best it can get without going to modern suspension. I have never ridden a early 500 that was set up, but the numbers aren't that far off. But I could immediately tell the 400 was a better package, when I rode one at the gap, and the 350, though it was a bit twitchy. I got to ride Walms's 400/500 and loved it. the handling was better than my 500, and just easier to ride. And to have fun (for me) it really needs the power of a 500. My next build with be a 400/500.
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Post by bcguide on Oct 21, 2014 0:21:24 GMT -5
Thanks
I have a s1 frame and found 2 74 h1 basket cases and was wondering if it was worth the trouble doing the swap
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paulh
3rd Gear
Adrenaline is brown
Posts: 528
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Post by paulh on Oct 21, 2014 12:59:50 GMT -5
Thanks I have a s1 frame and found 2 74 h1 basket cases and was wondering if it was worth the trouble doing the swap Very little fab work required, Rather simple and well worth the effort. IMHO..It really does not handle much differently than a stock s3/kh, As Walms said the 18" front is key, Quickly tested mine with a 19" up front around the concession roads here and it really felt like driving a late H1, I went immediately to the 18" front Huge difference...Night and day |
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Post by Curtis on Oct 22, 2014 4:43:59 GMT -5
Dave (rz350ypvs) built an S1 500 bike
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Post by Curtis on Oct 22, 2014 5:06:02 GMT -5
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Post by bcguide on Oct 30, 2014 0:54:29 GMT -5
Thanks for the info I went and checked my old bike and its a s2. I am now the proud owner of 2 h1's one of which I think could be ceaned up and runing with out to much effort. I think I will be selling some s2 and h1 parts to fund a cafe build using the s2 and a 500 motor
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Post by daffey1 on Oct 30, 2014 9:08:45 GMT -5
Hey Curtis, I feel left out a little  Even lc came to N.S. to check my H1 in a S3 frame project. Must have been something I said about the Leafs  , lol |
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Even lc came to N.S. to check my H1 in a S3 frame project. Must have been something I said about the Leafs 
, lol