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Post by ballvo on Sept 23, 2011 11:01:45 GMT -5
I recently opened up my clutch cover to remove the stock clutch pusher that Donnie loaned me in Paris and refit the ball bearing clutch pusher that I had in there to begin with. I added a ball bearing into the cupped end of the pusher, mainly for the additional length as the adjuster screw on my Sytech release was almost buried in the lock nut.
Before this swap the clutch was working satisfactorily - it dragged a little in neutral, especially when cold, so I always make a point of trying to get into neutral before a stop, but never missed a shift or had any shifting issues.
Now, even after mutliple attempts at adjusting the thing, I'm having shifting issues that seem to be getting worse. My first ride I missed a shift and noticed every once in a while the shifter didn't want to engage solidly into the next gear.
Last night I was out for a bit and I ended up limping it home as I was mostly unable to shift into second. Occasionally it would drop in there and seem OK but more often than not, with clutch lever pulled in to the bars, the shifter wouldn't move. Always able to get into neutral while moving or stopped with engine not running.
Are these Sytech releases so touchy that I'm just not on the sweet spot with it or does this sound more ominous?? thanks.
Cheers, Neil
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Post by Deleted on Sept 23, 2011 11:15:14 GMT -5
the lever is nice und tight on the shift shaft? Mine came loose last week after Tweed, it didn't want to go into 2nd either.. or third
or sounds like the clutch isn't letting go niel.... all this started after the new pusher? The sweet spot on that actuator too is a real hard one to find, so I've heard.
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Post by tripletriplenut on Sept 23, 2011 11:35:50 GMT -5
there is a mod for the syntec pusher it relocates the cable pivot pin inboard on the lever. suppose to give you a wider adjustment or as Donnie said sweet spot. been looking but cannot find the mod thread.
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Post by Jim on Sept 23, 2011 12:12:30 GMT -5
It was the "m in sc" thread on KTW. Here's a paste:
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Post by lc on Sept 23, 2011 12:25:22 GMT -5
To start with a transmission should shift "up" just fine without using the clutch (engine relieved of load at time of shift). For instance the drag racers used to put pressure on the shift lever and use a kill switch instead of a clutch lever pull.
I'm running essentially the same setup as you. Redline supplied my BB pusher and the sytec was supplied by Andre. Vesrah plates, no wavies and KZ1000 springs. I have also run a kaw BB release. In at least one of the installations I had to run the additional ball. However I put the ball inside the release (where it basically does not move). I wonder if your ball under the pusher is offsetting with load and binding in the shaft bore?
The sytecs are reported to be a bit sensitive to adjustment. Provided you get the release's lever angle set close additional adjustment (for a hot clutch etc) can be made at the handlebar adjuster.
Another trick is to pull the clutch in (engine off) and kick it over to break the clutch free after the bike has sat for a while. This makes it go into first allot less harsh with engine running.
There was a particular batch of sytecs that were binding too. I have not had any issues with mine and actually re lubed it this spring for the first time since installation.
Proper cable routing (and a good free cable) plays into it too. You will want to route the cable to keep all bends as big a radius as possible.
Edit: Are you running Barnett plates? These are well reported to swell far more than other makers of plates and as such your adjustment will constantly be changing (more slack/less disengagement as the engine warms up). J
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Post by Walms on Sept 23, 2011 12:27:56 GMT -5
Make certain the actuator lever is perpendicular to the clutch cable half way through travel to get best mechanical advantage. Make sure gear shifter is tight and not binding... I can't think of much else...
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Post by Walms on Sept 23, 2011 12:30:34 GMT -5
Fricken hell, I didn't see all those replies when I started typing... Lol
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Post by lc on Sept 23, 2011 12:31:42 GMT -5
Make certain the actuator lever is perpendicular to the clutch cable half way through travel to get best mechanical advantage. Make sure gear shifter is tight and not binding... I can't think of much else... +1. Make sure to reduce all slop in the shift pedal linkage to a minimum! J
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Post by ballvo on Sept 23, 2011 16:55:29 GMT -5
Thanks for all the replies, guys.
I'll double check but I'm pretty sure the shift lever is nice and snug on the shaft with little or no play. I recall seeing M in SC's sytech mod thread so I'll search that out and consider it.
Scott, your comment on the ball being offset under load and binding in the bore is something I hadn't considered, but will keep in mind if I have to pull the cover again. Cable routing is fine and yes, I am running Barnett plates. So maybe I need to account for that while setting it up...
I've been using H2RTuner's clutch adjustment for dummies instructions but now I'll try Andrew's suggestion of ensuring the actuating lever is perpendicular to the cable at half pull of the clutch lever and see how that works out.
Gotta get it sorted out shortly - we're in for several days of warm and sunny weather.
Cheers, Neil
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Post by Jim on Sept 23, 2011 17:58:01 GMT -5
I recall seeing M in SC's sytech mod thread so I'll search that out and consider it. ? I did that for you and quoted it in my post above.
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Post by lc on Sept 23, 2011 19:01:46 GMT -5
I recall seeing M in SC's sytech mod thread so I'll search that out and consider it. ? I did that for you and quoted it in my post above. Jim, Perhaps post an actual link as there was a drawing posted in that thread too? J
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Post by Jim on Sept 24, 2011 9:04:53 GMT -5
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Post by JA-Moo on Sept 24, 2011 11:36:26 GMT -5
The sytec has a finer thread, so the arm has to be adjusted all the way down, or you will not get enough movement to release the plates. Mark's mod helps a lot. You still have to have the arm adjusted all the way down. A1/8th turn of slack should give enough room for expansion. The Barnette plates do suck.
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Post by garand1944 on Sept 24, 2011 14:06:21 GMT -5
The Barnette plates do suck. I don't know.....a crowd always enjoys the GP start
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Post by ballvo on Sept 25, 2011 15:51:46 GMT -5
Thanks Jim. I recalled that Mark included a drawing on that thread so that's why I was going to search it out. Well I tried various slightly differing adjustments on the Sytech release as well as adjustments at the handlebar while driving but was still unable to shift into third gear. N - 1st - 2nd shifts OK but still seems to pop into N occasionally. This morning I decided to pull the clutch cover and remove the ball bearing clutch release and replace with a stock release. The ball bearing Id placed in the cupped end of the release looked fine and it doesnt appear that it could locate other than centrally while under pressure from the clutch rod. Also used a magnet to pull out the clutch rod to check for straightness and it seems OK. Bolted everything back up and just back from a test ride. It still will not go into 3rd gear. I tried what lc suggested and upshifted with no clutch. I found that it would only go into 3rd if I was lugging along at about 2500-3000 rpm. Any higher than that and the shift lever feels like it cannot move any further. The linkage is nice and snug and what I found with it just sitting is that I can shift, with a normal sounding solid clunk, from N - 1st and from 1st - 2nd but not into third. Might this be caused by shift fork issues. Im not seeing any metal bits when I drain the tranny oil. I did replace the entire transmission after shimming it, including shift forks, with used but better condition than what was in there. Ive only got just over 600 mi on it since rebuilding and I hate to think that Ive got to open it up. If it comes to that can I, or should I, leave the top end on when I invert it to split the cases. Thanks for any suggestions. N.
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